(To the tune of Salt n’ Pepa’s “Let’s Talk About Sex”)
Let’s talk about guns, baby
Let’s talk constitutionality
Let’s talk about all the shooting sprees
And the dead beings that may be
Let’s talk about guns
Let’s talk about guns
mi·li·tia
[mi-lish-uh]
noun
1. a body of citizens enrolled for military service, and called out periodically for drill but serving full time only in emergencies.2. a body of citizen soldiers as distinguished from professional soldiers.3. all able-bodied males considered by law eligible for military service.4. a body of citizens organized in a paramilitary group and typically regarding themselves as defenders of individual rights against the presumed interference of the federal government.
Wayne LaPierre has been an employee of the NRA since 1978.
He became the Executive Director of the NRA Institute for Legislative Action in 1986, and became the Executive VP of the NRA in 1991.
For 34 years, LaPierre has been working to make the NRA the single most powerful lobby in the nation. Consider this, as summarized by D.H. Stone of The Pragmatic Progressive page:
This little man is Wayne LaPierre. Since 1991 he has been the executive vice president and chief executive officer of the National Rifle Association, an extremist organization heavily supported by gun manufacturers.
The NRA is opposed to even the most modest restrictions on gun sales and ownership.
The NRA opposes background checks for private gun sales.
The NRA opposes waiting periods for gun sales.The NRA opposes restrictions on the carrying of concealed weapons.
The NRA opposes measures to prohibit the sale of guns to people on the federal government’s terrorist watch list.
The NRA supports “stand your ground laws.”
The NRA supports laws to permit faculty and students to carry concealed weapons on the campuses of state colleges and universities.
The NRA supports laws to permit patrons of bars and restaurants to carry concealed weapons.
The NRA is lobbying to eliminate gun-free zones and permit guns in elementary schools and even daycare centers.
There are nearly 9,000 gun homicides in America every year, far more than in any other developed country.
When Al Queda killed 3,000 Americans, our leaders launched two wars, sent more than 6,500 American soldiers to their deaths, and killed hundreds of thousands of Iraqis and Afghans.
They also eventually hunted down and killed Bin Laden.
But our politicians cower in fear of Wayne LaPierre.
Home of the brave, my ass.— DH Stone
An example of LaPierre’s paranoid fear mongering , from his October 2012 NRA endorsement of Mitt Romney, via watchdog group MeetTheNRA.org:
On October 5, 2012, LaPierre announced the National Rifle Association Political Victory Fund’s endorsement of Republican presidential candidate Mitt Romney in Fishersville, Virginia. LaPierre stated, “The dream is to save America and our freedom … You’re sure not free if you can’t defend yourself and everyone knows that. And I also know something else about ya. You’re not gonna surrender submit, succumb, or be marginalized. You’re ready to make a difference for freedom in this country. And we have to do that, because we’re standin’ on the edge of a [President Barack] Obama cliff with our freedom. If President Obama gets reelected, he’s gonna have one to three Supreme Court appointments and I guarantee you this, if that happens, one to three more [Justice Sonia] Sotomayors and [Justice Elena] Kagans and we can kiss our constitutional right to own a firearm in the United States goodbye, along with a lot of the rest of our freedoms. And we can’t let that happen … Does anybody trust an Obama Administration in the second term to be anywhere near negotiating with a club of governments called the United Nations on our freedom? Their gun plan is: Turn over your firearms and your protection to the government. The government will protect ya… That U.N. plan is about global agencies monitoring, surveillance, supervision, lists, all institutionalized within the bureaucracy of the United Nations … I guarantee this, if your glass breaks at 2:00 a.m. at night somewhere from some criminal, you all know that those baby blue helmets of the U.N. aren’t gonna be there to protect ya and neither is President Obama or [U.S. Attorney General] Eric Holder. What will protect ya is our freedom that we have here in the United States under the Second Amendment to the Constitution. And there’s not a government or authority on the planet that can match that if you’re ever in that situation.” LaPierre was referring to a U.N. Small Arms Treaty that would set only international standards for the import/export of conventional weapons—leaving it to individual countries to “regulate internal transfers of arms and national ownership, including through national constitutional protections on private ownership.” Finally, LaPierre added, “We’ve only seen the tip of the iceberg on what’s in store if President Obama is reelected … It’s the most dangerous election of our lifetime … All of our freedoms, all of our rights, all of our way of life, all of the Second Amendment is on the line.”
When Kansas City Chiefs player Jovan Belcher killed his girlfriend (and the mother of his three month-old daughter) and then drove to the team practice facility where he fatally shot himself in the head in front of staff and police, Bob Costas made a moving plea for sane gun laws during halftime of the next televised game.
And then Wayne LaPierre opened his big hell-maw and started spouting jingo-jango“commies wanna take yur GUNZ and steal my money-machine” bullshit faster than you could say “soulless paranoia chasers”.
Hey, gun lobby???
I am a fucking flaming libtard.
I don’t want to grab your guns. In fact, I am seriously considering purchasing one myself, because this election cycle has convinced me that if the kind of government atmosphere you are pursuing comes to fruition, my black female ass is gonna need a gun. Or two.
But when I go to get that gun, I have no problem with a background check.
Or a waiting period.
Or safety certification.
Or following whatever steps are necessary to carry my weapon on my person if I move to a neighborhood that is like downtown Beirut and I need to cap a motherfucker who makes the mistake of carrying Skittles and Iced Tea and WaHWB (Wearing a Hoodie While Black) .
Handguns and hunting rifles are one thing.
High-powered assault weapons with hundred round clips and armor-piercing ammunition are another.
There is a reason assault weapons are called ASSAULT weapons, not DEFENSE weapons.
Anyone who says they need them for defense are either surrounded by Crips, Bloods, and the Varrio Nuevo Estrada, or they are crazy militia types prepping to “refresh the Tree of Liberty” with the ” Blood of Patriots”.
Anyone who says ordinary, law-abiding Americans should be free to stockpile as many of them as they like because the Second Amendment supposedly says they can is a total and complete jackass.
WELL
REGULATED
MILITIA.
Despite what Wayne LaPierre and the NRA would have you believe, those words ARE in the Second Amendment, and those words DO NOT MEAN WHAT LAPIERRE HAS TRICKED YOU INTO BELIEVING.
This is an AR-15 ASSAULT weapon**
.
These are some of the most commonly used murder weapons, and their alternate uses.
A Glock and a Sig Sauer 9MM handgun were recovered inside the Sandy Hook Elementary School, and an AR-15 was also recovered at the scene, though reports are not saying if it was actually used in the massacre of 20 students and eight teachers and administrators.
If it were………………. just imagine the tremendous damage to tiny bodies, some struck as many as ELEVEN TIMES.
Is a twisted misinterpretation of the intents of long-dead men REALLY so sacred that these lives were worth sacrificing to uphold it?
Because as troubled as Adam Lanza was, it is being reported now that Nancy Lanza, his mother and the legal owner of these guns, was more than a little troubled, too.
These children are dead, first and foremost, because a crazy man invaded their school and took their lives.
And our national obsession with the unobstructed acquisition of guns and ammo – INCLUDING MILITARY GRADE GUNS AND AMMO – helped him to do it.
It has helped almost every mass shooter since Obama took office, and almost every mass shooter before that. Random street crime involves illegally obtained guns far more than mass shootings do. Mass shooters either own the guns outright, or they take them from family members who do. Mass shooting guns are NOT black market guns, they are part of the family stash.
A roll call of people who have been killed by family stashes across the nation, via the Marquis DeSuave:
Charlotte Bacon, 6, Grace McDonnell, 7, Daniel Barden, 7, Anne Marie Murphy, 52, Rachel Davino, 29, Emile Parker, 6, Olivia Engel, 6, Jack Pinto, 6, Josephine Gay, 7, Noah Pozner, 6, Ana M. Marquez-Greene, 6, Caroline Previdi, 6, Dylan Hockley, 6, Jessica Rekos, 6, Madeline F. Hsu, 6, Avielle Richman, 6, Catherine V. Hubbar, 6, Lauren Russeau, 30, Chase Kowalski, 7, Mary Sherlach, 56, Dawn Hocksprung, 47, Victoria Soto, 27, Jesse Lewis, 6, Benjamin Wheeler, 6, Allison N. Wyatt, 6, Newtown, CN 14 December, 2012.
Steven Mathew Forsyth, 45, and Cindy Ann Yuille, 54, Clackamas, OR 11 December 2012.
Reuven Rahamim, 61, Rami Cooks, 62, Ron Edberg, 58, Jacob Beneke, 34, Keith Basinski, 50, Minneapolis, MN 27 September 2012
Satwant Kaleka, 62, Sita Singh, 41, Ranjit Singh, 49, Suveg Singh Khattra, 84, Prakash Singh, 39, Paramjit Kaur, 41, Sikh temple shooting, Oak Creek,WI 5 August 2012
John Blunk, 26, AJ Boik, 18, Jesse E. Childress, 29, Gordon W. Cowden, 51, Jessica Ghawi, 24, Matt McQuinn, 27, Micayla Medek, 23, Veronica Moser-Sullivan, 6, Alex Sullivan, 27, Alexander Teves, 24, Rebecca Ann Wingo, 32, Aurora, CO 22 July, 2012
Joe “Vito” Albanese, 52, Drew Keriakedes, 45, 3 others, Seattle, WA 29 May 2012, .
Dannaer Fields, 49, Bobby Clark, 54, and William Allen, 31, Tulsa, Oklahoma April 6, 2012.
Tshering Rinzing Bhutia, 38, Doris Chibuko, 40, Sonam Chodon, 33, Grace Eunhae Kim, 23, Kathleen Ping, 24, Judith Seymour, 53, Lydia Sim, 21, Oakland, CA, 2 April 2012.
Demetrius Hewlin, 17, Russell King Jr., 17, Daniel Parmertor, 16, Chardon, Ohio, 27 February 2012.
United States Representative Gabriel Giffords (wounded), Christina Taylor Green, 9, Dorothy “Dot” Morris, 76, United States District Judge, Chief Judge John Roll, 63, Phyllis Schneck, 79, Dorwan Stoddard,7 6, Gabriel “Gabe” Zimmerman, 30, Tuscon, AZ, 8 January 2011.
Adriel D Johnson Sr., 53, Maria Ragland Davis, 51, Gopi K. Podila, 53, Huntsville, AL, 12 February 2010.
Michael Grant Cahill, 62, Major Libardo Eduardo Caraveo US Army, 52, Staff Sergeant Justin Michael DeCrow US Army, 32, Captain John P. Gaffaney US Army, 56, Specialist Frederick Greene US Army, 29, Specialist Jason Dean Hunt US Army, 22, Staff Sergeant Amy Sue Krueger US Army, 29, Private First Class Aaron Thomas Nemelka US Army, 19, Private First Class Michael S. Pearson US Army, 22, Captain Russell Gilbert Seager US Army, 51, Private First Class Francheska Velez US Army, 21(pregnant, fetus deceased), Lieutenant Colonel Juanita L. Warman US Army, 55, Private First Class Kham See Xiong US Army, 23, Fort Hood, TX, November, 2009.
Parveen Ali, 26, Almir Olimpio Alves, 43, Marc Henry Bernard, 44, Maria Sonia Bernard, 46, Li Guo, 47, Lan Ho, 39, Layla Khalil, 53, Roberta King, 72, Jiang Ling, 22, Hong Xiu “Amy” Mao Marsland, 35, Dolores Yigal, 53, Hai Hong Zhong, 54, Maria Zobniw, 60, Binghamton, NY, 3 April 2009
————————————————————–
Inaction in Action. Do something America.
-MdS
I’m feeling more optimistic about some positive movement on this issue than I ever have, while I can’t express how deeply disturbing it is that it took an event as horrifying as Sandy Hook to shake sense into many people.
I don’t know what to make of it, but the NRA’s Book of Faces and Twitter feeds have gone dark. I don’t know if it’s just maintenance, a PR “let’s go dark to show “respect” move, or something else entirely.
Time will tell, I guess.
But the prominent conservative voices that are starting to yell”STOP THE INSANITY” a la Susan Powter is an encouraging phenomenon right now.
Everything I looked at even the labeled info description is the biggest lying I’ve seen in some time. Listen anti gun women and men the fact your lacking education if guns. The gun can not put out more then one bullet for every trigger pull. Is highly illegal to own a fully automatic weapon. This weapon function is just like a 870 Remington the most common hunting gun in American. But doesn’t look Scarey and has the cosmetic look of a military ar-15. I’m retiring shortly and these pages trying to mislead Americans to feel in danger by weapons make me sick. As far as I’m concerned the people that should be charged is criminals using weapons to harm others and those that don’t protect there families. Your leaving your children unprotected to get murdered and rapped, rob ect. Law abiding people don’t do crimes so there second admendment shouldn’t be messed with. The anti gun personal will always be a victim and I for one will always have my family safe.
Well said my dearest sista woman. I adore you.
I adore you, too, you brash and ballsy blogging goddess!
♥.
you can go fuck your self the second amendment is to keep a government from having to much power.A government should fear the people not the other way around
You should pick up a history book and a copy of the constitution and read them instead of just swallowing the Cliff Notes for Gullible Jingoists, Mr.Browning.
And thanks to my trusty Rabbit, I CAN go fuck myself, which I have no doubts would be substantially more satisfying than what you do for Mrs. Browning.
Or Mr., if that’s your bag – I don’t discriminate against sexual preference.
Just douchebaginess, which you seem to have in spades.
Toodles.
So nice to see I don’t need to refer to you as a lady with a trucker mouth like yours. Well, I think the problem is your lack of education made it to hard for you to understand what you read. The second admendment is for those Americans that care to protect there families and if need to protect them from even a government that decides to become a dictator. When one of your family members gets killed by a criminal with an unregistered weapon don’t bitch how could this happen. It happen because they decided not to protect nor have a family member protect them. Cops only truely show up to investigate 90% if the time after the crime. And law abiding gun owners register there weapons criminals don’t so the chances of tracing is slim.
“So nice to see I don’t need to refer to you as a lady with a trucker mouth like yours”
That might sting a little, if I were inclined to give two shits about your opinion on my first amendment right to curse like a motherfucking sailor when dumb-assed gun nuts are so in love with their firearms that they try to argue that mentally ill people should have free and clear access to guns and ammo because Obama is Hitler and without AR-15′s America’s women are magically going to become victims of all the rapes and murders that gun-loving conservatives are always saying are exaggerated liberal lies designed to explode the abortion count………so yeah, fuck you.
“Well, I think the problem is your lack of education made it to hard for you to understand what you read. The second admendment is for those Americans that care to protect there families and if need to protect them from even a government that decides to become a dictator. When one of your family members gets killed by a criminal with an unregistered weapon don’t bitch how could this happen. It happen because they decided not to protect nor have a family member protect them. Cops only truely show up to investigate 90% if the time after the crime. And law abiding gun owners register there weapons criminals don’t so the chances of tracing is slim.”
Did a man who cannot properly construct, punctuate or spell in his paragraphs REALLY try to say I have a “lack of education”?
I (and my “trucker mouth”) can think circles around you while in a tequila-infused Jello shot-induced coma.
Go home, Hervey, you’re drunk – and a gullible jingoist who has allowed the man behind the gun-lobby curtain to turn you into another scared, mindless cash machine.
A fool and his money are soon parted, and the fool is way more likely to kill himself or a family member than any band of roving thugs he has convinced himself are going to pounce at any moment.Perhaps you should go put a bullet in your family vehicle and never drive again, as the chances of dying in a car crash are higher than your chances of using your gun to stave off a home invasion.
Toodles to you, too.
I’d like to point out a couple mistakes in your article. You call the AR-15 a ” High-powered assault weapons with hundred round clips and armor-piercing ammunition are another.”
First, an AR-15 is typically chambered in the puny .223 Remington caliber. This caliber is not even powerful enough to legally hunt deer in most states.
Secondly, you show a picture of an AR-15 with a 30 round magazine and state that it holds 100 rounds. A 100 round magazine is much much larger and is about the size of a volleyball.
Thirdly, you state that an AR-15 uses ‘armor piercing ammo’. Any firearm CAN use armor piercing ammo, but true armor piercing ammo is NOT available to civilians. A typical hunting rifle will puncture most/all body armor, when a typical AR-15 won’t.
Forth, a typical hunting shotgun loaded with buckshot can put more firepower downrange FASTER than an AR-15.
So, do you really want shotguns and deer rifles (which are more powerful and can provide MORE firepower quicker than an AR-15) outlawed as well?
Just wanted to add some REAL firearm facts to your discussion. I’ll keep my personal feelings about the 2nd amendment to myself. Just curious if you are intellectually honest enough to either admit that you want to ban all firearms (including hunting rifles/shotguns that are more powerful than an AR-15) or that you didn’t realize the AR-15 was so weak when compared to the typical hunting rifle and/or hunting shotgun. Or maybe you just want to ban the ‘black’ evil looking ones that Hollywood has convinced you are so bad?
Sincerely,
Don Peacock
First off I did NOT “call the AR-15 a ” High-powered assault weapons with hundred round clips and armor-piercing ammunition are another.” ”
The passage reads, verbatim:
NOWHERE in there is the AR-15 mentioned,I was speaking of assault weapons in general, so I ask if you are intellectually honest enough to admit that in your zeal to correct, you took a section out of context because it suited your needs better.
I am not a gun expert and have never claimed to be….the pictures and info given are stamped with their sources, and the websites listed back up the timeline info…I took it to mean the gun specs were correct, too. MY BAD. However, you stated that “Thirdly, you state that an AR-15 uses ‘armor piercing ammo’”, which is untrue. NOWHERE IN THE PIECE DO I STATE THAT AR-15′s USE ARMOUR-PIERCING BULLETS…… I state that people who claim to need them for hunting or home defense are full of shit, and I stand by that. So called “Cop Killer ” bullets are for one nefarious purpose only, and their “inavailability ” to civilians does not stop them from wanting them, or hoping that restriction will change.
Obviously you did NOT read the entire post, or you would realize that no, I do not want to ban all firearms………I in fact stated that I am seriously considering training to use, and purchasing, one – With an emphasis on TRAINING TO USE, as legions of responsible gun owners have.NOT just running out and buying one because WHOO! CLINT EASTWOOD! SECOND AMENDMENT!SUCK IT LIBTARDS! ‘MERICA, FUCK YEE_HAW!, which is sadly the impetus for some gun owners .
Guns themselves do not bother me…..it’s the nutty, whackadoodle people who think that it is unreasonable to not want schizophrenics, psychotic, mentally unstable people having free, unrestrained access to them whom I find frightening. Sure, nuts who can’t get guns may just use a knife, but when was the last time a crazy man walked into a crowded theater or a school yard with a cache of Ginsu knives and started throwing them while yelling like Gordon Ramsay?
What’s that, you say?
Never????
Well, fuck a duck.
Hollywood has not convinced me that “the ‘black’ evil looking ones….are so bad”. Anyone who gets their impressions of guns from movies where face-off occur at a ten yard distance and no body gets hit and people fly 15 feet through the air when they DO get hit is an ignoramus.My view of guns and their availability IS influenced by people like Adam and Nancy Lanza, Jovan Belcher, Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold,George Zimmerman, Jared Loughner, Seung-Hui Cho, the Son of Sam, Scott Roeder, and a host of others. They have convinced me that checks and balances are not an insane thing to have.
Banning guns outright is NOT the answer, and neither is the “fuck it, let’s just arm EVERYBODY” approach.
You are free to argue that it is, Mr. Peacock, if that’s your bag……….just don’t expect people with brains to sit back and say “OK!”.
Not gonna happen.
Sincerely,
DC Martin
If I misquoted your exact words, I apologize. But you did in fact say
“Handguns and hunting rifles are one thing.
High-powered assault weapons with hundred round clips and armor-piercing ammunition are another.”
My point is simply that so-called assault weapons are actually NOT high power when compared to typical hunting weapons and hunting shotguns. I was only trying to point out the errors in your data (including the error in the diagram you where using).
The fact remains that so called assault weapons are only in that category because they are ‘evil looking black guns’ portrayed that way by Hollywood. The mechanism used in the AR-15, AK-47 etc. is not technically different than the mechanisms used in most typical hunting semi-auto rifles and shotguns. The so-called assault weapons are not nearly as powerful as hunting rifles and don’t have the firepower that a typical hunting shotgun has. If Hollywood started glorifying hunting shotguns and hunting rifles the way they do the ‘evil looking assault weapons’ we would unfortunately see mass killings with those weapons. The weapons are not the issue, it is the Hollywood glorification and the lack of Mental health assistance that leads to these unfortunate events. Forcing law abiding citizens to jump through meaningless hoops will do nothing to abate these situations.
I didn’t state in my response anything about the mythical ‘cop killer’ bullets. That is a Hollywood myth. I simply stated that ‘armor piercing’ bullets can be shot from ANY type of weapon and you shouldn’t imply that assault weapons are bad because they shoot ‘armor piercing bullets’. Armor piercing bullets are NOT available to civilians and there are already federal laws against possession of them. Hunting rifles with normal hunting bullets WILL defeat most body armor. The puny little assault weapon rounds will not normally defeat heavy body armor.
I was simply trying to point out some issues with your posting and hope I’ve helped clear up a few of the incorrect items and misconceptions that an uneducated (with regard to firearms) reader might glean from the article.
Don
The input IS appreciated.
As we have BOTH pointed out, mental health issues are a LARGE part of the picture, and while you make some very good points, the “Forcing law abiding citizens to jump through meaningless hoops will do nothing to abate these situations” argument is not foolproof ( of course, NO argument for EITHER side is). Nancy Lanza was a law abiding citizen who jumped through all the right hoops………and it appears that she was also mentally unstable. Just because you are law-abiding does not mean you are fit to be issued a gun license. The truth of the matter is that all three elements you mentioned are contributing factors :the weapons, the glorification and the lack of mental health assistance. And the glorification is not just coming from Hollywood, the NRA does a bang-up job of fetishizing gun ownership and the weapons themselves. Do you honestly think the NRA and the companies they have circular endorsements with do not have a backstage interest in the types and number of weapons used in films? They are a product placement just like Pepsi, Doritos, and insert-car-company-name-here.
Gun manufacturers are not being led like lambs to the Hollywood slaughter, they are arranging the show.
-DC
If Nancy Lanza was mentally unstable, then she shouldn’t have been able to purchase a firearm. If she’d been adjudicated mentally defective, she would have had to lie on the federal firearms forms (form 4473 question 11.f) and the Connecticut State Patrol background checks must have failed. Also, she should have prevented access to those firearms by ALL other persons and especially from her son (that she knew was mentally unstable). It’s completely irresponsible for anyone to provide firearm to children or mentally unstable individuals. I personally have a gun safe that is inaccessible to others.
I’d be interested in any PROOF you have with regard to the NRA having any interest in firearm product placements in movies. The NRA has been the biggest critic of the glorification of firearms in movies and video games over the last 3 decades, THAT is a fact. The NRA has led on the increase in punishment for firearm related crime. The NRA has led in firearm safety for children. Lookup Eddie the Eagle coloring books, the reinforce to small children if they see a gun, to NOT Touch, Leave the Room, Tell an adult. The NRA is the #1 trainer of law enforcement firearms trainers. They have trained nearly 55,000 law enforcement firearms trainers since 1960.
Don’t believe the media hype that the NRA is a bloodthirsty violence promoting racist organization. That perception couldn’t be farther from the truth. Amazingly, the movie and media industry not only promotes firearm violence, but spreads lies about the one organization that does the most to prevent firearms accidents.
Have a great day,
Don
If the NRA is so against the Hollywood portrayal of firearms, why does their museum have display that is promoted on their website thusly:
(nramuseum.org/the-museum/the-galleries/william-b-ruger-special-exhibits.aspx)
And why do they so staunchly oppose background checks at gun shows?
Why not set the same standards for gun shows as brick-and-mortar gun retailers?
Your statement (“If Nancy Lanza was mentally unstable, then she shouldn’t have been able to purchase a firearm”)rather simplistically pre-supposes that mental illness can’t manifest AFTER a firearm is legally purchased. Things that impair your ability to drive (seizures, glaucoma, etc.) can manifest long after you first obtain a license…..gun licenses should be subject to expiration and re-certification just like a driver’s license. Had Nancy Lanza been taken for mental evaluations by those around her when she began exhibiting her bizarre behaviors and were subject to periodic re-certs, her son may not have had that handy stash of weapons with which to murder her and 28 other people.
I do not believe the NRA itself is racist, but it certainly does hold a tangible appeal for a large part of this country’s racist element.
Once again, since you seem to be TOTALLY missing it:
I DO NOT WANT TO BAN GUNS.
I simply do not have a problem with controlling the access that unstable PEOPLE have to them. PEOPLE control, not GUN control.
I don’t hate guns. Nor do I feel that owning/possessing one is the Holy Grail of American life.
Which brings me to an observation, of you in particular and rabid gun advocates in general, Mr. Peacock:
You have mounted a VERY impassioned defense of guns, ammo, the second amendment, and the NRA……three fairly involved comments worth.
Not ONCE did you express any empathy with or regret for what has caused the topic to become hot again in the first place……the murder of 28 people at a school, by a nutjob with semi-automatic guns he should not have had.
Three comments worth of defending pieces of cold hard steel and the organization that seems to place them just behind the bible but in front of their fellow citizens (Gods, Guns, and Country, anyone?), and ZERO mention of the murder victims of Sandy Hook.
They’re just collateral damage in the NRA gun lobby’s campaign to arm America, they’re not worth acknowledging.
Well done, soldier.
They do back round checks at gun shows that take just as long as if you went to a gun store.
Guns belong in gun museums, cars belong in car museums. Movies, Hollywood and actors are a part of our history. The NRA museum has firearms that have been used as props in films by famous people, car museums contain cars that have been in films, driven and owned by famous people. Your assertion that finding Hollywood firearms/props in an NRA museum means the NRA supports the violent use of those firearms is as ludicrous as saying the automobile museum in Illinois that has one of John Dillingers get away cars is promoting bank robbery and murder. That argument is plain silly.
Dealers at gun shows already MUST abide by the same federal background check laws that brick and mortar stores do. Private sales have a different set of laws, regardless if those sales occur in a gun show parking lot or a persons living room. This is the slippery slope that the anti-gun lobby wants to start down. There are a number of states that already have purchase permit/background checks/waiting limits for ALL purchases. Interestingly enough, those states have the HIGHEST incidence of crime. The states with the fewest firearm law/restrictions have the LOWEST incidence of violent crime.
I don’t see you asking for background checks for private sales of cars. Yet drunk driving kills and maims a lot more people than are murdered with firearms. The supreme court has held that the 2nd amendment is an individual right, there is NO right to own a car, so background checks for all private transfers of cars would seem like a more prudent and constitutional approach to saving lives than infringing on the second amendment.
I have great sorrow for the victims, family and survivors of the Sandy Hook attack. This tragedy can be blamed on the irresponsible storage of legally acquired firearms and a mentally unstable individual. Lanza could have just as easily firebombed the school, or rammed a bunch of kids waiting for the bus with a car. Crazy people do crazy things.
I didn’t mention it because there is nothing I can say or do that can ease the survivors pain nor bring those victims back (I wish there was). I likewise didn’t bring up the numerous examples of firearms being used to save/protect lives (like the 15 year old that used his dads AR-15 to protect his 12 year old sister from burglars in a suburb of Houston in mid Dec. 2012). Since we’re on the topic. According to surveys performed by pro-gun, anti-gun and neutral parties, firearms are used between 100,000 (actually fired) and 2.5 million (shown/threatened use) times per year by law abiding citizens to defend themselves from robbery, murder, rape and other crimes.
I didn’t bring up the tragedy, as I was simply focusing on the incorrect facts/assertions you made in you original posting.
Have a great day,
Don
There is a big difference in putting on an exhibit for historical context and promoting it as such, and putting on an exhibit and promoting it in a way that clearly counts on the target audience being familiar with and entertained by the source material. People do not flock to a Scarface exhibit because they want to closely examine the grips and barrels, they want to take a picture in front of it aping Tony Montana’s famous “Say hello to my little friend!” scene.
Your comparison to private car sales is ludicrous. You can’t buy a car from your neighbor and just hit the road – you have to register it, get a clear title, insure it, and as for DUI’s…..if you get one, you lose your license pay fines, do jail time, and once you are reinstated, you pay higher insurance, etc.. Having the same kinds of safeguards for gun ownership is not unreasonable.
Cars are designed for DRIVING.
Guns are designed for KILLING.
The second amendment gives you the right to own and maintain firearms.
The second amendment also says that that right exists for the maintenance of a WELL REGULATED MILITIA.
Keyword being REGULATED.
Have a great, WELL REGULATED day.
DC
Well, According to the Supreme Court (twice in the last few years), the Second Amendment is an INDIVIDUAL right. Also, “Well Regulated” meant to have something “properly operating” when the bill of rights was written. So according to the Supreme Court (and the founders). The Second amendment is an individual right that asks us to keep our arms operating properly.
As far as your car example. It is NOT illegal to operate a car without a license on private property. The laws don’t care about licenses, insurance etc. on private property. Also, the license and insurance requirements are STATE laws, not Federal. The basis for a license/insurance is founded on the use of the public thoroughfares, not on ownership.
Also, firearms are designed to fire a cartridge. They are a tool that can be used for good or evil (just like a baseball bat, hammer, automobile etc.). Firearms are used MANY TIMES more often to protect/defend individuals than they are used to do harm to innocents.
I truly wish a good guy with a gun had ended the spree in Newtown before all those poor kids were killed. Why is it that almost every mass shooting in last 30 years has happened in a ‘gun free zone’? You can thank liberal thinking for creating these killing fields that enable crazies unrestrained access to innocent victims.
There are thousands of examples of women using a firearm to stop rapes, senior citizens protecting themselves from criminals etc.
Thank you for you kind wishes. With a little Motrin to keep all my parts operating correctly, I WILL have a “Well Regulated” day,
Have a great day,
Donp
“As far as your car example. It is NOT illegal to operate a car without a license on private property. The laws don’t care about licenses, insurance etc. on private property. Also, the license and insurance requirements are STATE laws, not Federal. The basis for a license/insurance is founded on the use of the public thoroughfares, not on ownership.”
Ah, so then permits to and restrictions for where you may carry your weapons OFF of your property and into the public square are NOT unreasonable infringements on your liberties.
PERFECT.
Keep your handguns and shotguns all you like, ON YOUR PRIVATE PROPERTY. If you wish to bring them into my child’s school or the mall or the SuperDome or the library or anywhere else………..you should not have a problem with being certified,having a permit, and carrying insurance. Otherwise, like your car, keep it on your private property and feel free to shoot at will there. If you feel the need to play Serpico on the street, be prepared to show that you are qualified to do so.
I truly wish a good guy with a gun had ended the spree in Newtown before all those poor kids were killed. Why is it that almost every mass shooting in last 30 years has happened in a ‘gun free zone’? You can thank liberal thinking for creating these killing fields that enable crazies unrestrained access to innocent victims.
There are thousands of examples of women using a firearm to stop rapes, senior citizens protecting themselves from criminals etc.
Gun stats show that those “examples” are often anecdotal, not evidence-based, and are still dwarfed by the number of accidental shootings of children/adults by family members and the number of crimes that are NOT succesfully fended off by gun owners, and in fact end with the gun owner dead and their weapon often stolen.
It would be nice if Sandy Hook had ended like a Hollywood movie, but if you know anyone in law enforcement they will tell you that more often than not, a good guy with a gun is more likely to cause collateral damage and get him/herself injured or killed. It’s AWESOME the few times it happens, but changing every venue into the OK Corral is not going to balance those stats out…………….it’s just going to encourage gung-ho people with Die-Hard fantasies to muck up situations that they are not equipped for, but think they can handle because they stayed at a Quality Inn once.
Actually, having good guys with guns in place will work as a DETERRENT. The whole point is PREVENTION. The Aurora shooter could have picked any of 7 different movie theaters. Of the seven in the area, 6 of them allow licensed concealed carry. One does not. Guess which theater he chose? Thats right, the one ‘gun free zone’. Do you think this was just an ‘accident’? Crazy people aren’t stupid, their just crazy. They choose unprotected victims. That is a fact.
I wish we lived in a world that didn’t have bad guys with guns, I wish we lived in a world where criminals respected laws. If you waved a magic wand and all guns disappeared, there would still be crazy people doing horrible things. The difference would be that frail people and small women would be at the TOTAL mercy of the big bad guys.
Have a great day,
Don
Cowards are always going to go for what they think are easy pickings, and over-confident people are always going to think they will be able to take down a shooter in a smoke-filled, dark movie theater. You yourself argued the point earlier that the guns/ammo used are not that powerful, so taking you at your word as knowing what you are talking about, what good would panicked concealed-carry gun owners have truly done in a dark movie theater where the perp had smoke bombs and body armour? How much higher would the death toll have been with a bunch of people firing into a panicked crowd at will?????
I, too, wish we lived in a world that didn’t have bad guys with guns and where criminals respected laws, and I will remind you once again and for the last time, I have no desire to wave a magic wand and make all guns disappear. Sadly any time the gun debate heats up, people like you keep insisting that anyone who wants to further curtail the easy access to guns that unstable people have and would like to see a tad more responsibility placed on their ownership besides “here’s your gun, don’t lose it, happy shooting for the rest of your life!” wants to strip gun owners of every firearm they have, put them in a big pile, and burn them like it’s a Salem Witch trial. It’s an easy way to deflect from having a sensible discussion – if you whip everyone into a “WHARRRGARBBLLL, CONSTITUUUUUUUUUTIOOOOOONNNN!!!!!!!!!” frenzy and talk circles around the pertinent facts, you get the exact result the NRA wants, whih is them holding all the cards and all the cash from they raise from people who haven’ figured out that they are being played.
Interesing that in the news today is the shooting death of Keith Ratliff, one of YouTube’s most popular gun enthusiasts.(dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2259190/Keith-Ratliff-Popular-online-guns-explosives-expert-shot-death-rural-Georgia-road.html -my blog theme makes use of a red font for links in author comments, hence no “http://www”):
Good guy, had guns, still dead.
Gabby Giffords is a gun owner, and that did not change after her shooting. She and her husband just started Americans for Responsible Solutions (americansforresponsiblesolutions.org). From their FB “About” description:
They wrote an excellent OpEd piece on USA Today you should read – usatoday.com/story/opinion/2013/01/07/gabby-giffords-mark-kelly-tucson-shooting-gun-control/1816383/ .
You should also read Richard Florida’s study on gun ownership and gun crime deaths, excerpted in this National Journal article (nationaljournal.com/domesticpolicy/analysis-the-geography-of-gun-violence-20120720) . Yes he DOES plainly say that while correlation is not causation, correlations can be suggestive, and are in stark contrast to the “everyone should be armed, it makes you safer” mantra:
And I’m going to close out this conversation with the words of General Stanley McChrystal, who knows a thing or two about guns, ammo, their capacity for protection and their capacity for destruction, and with the quote on LaPierre/NRA from my original post:
So once again, for the last time, I reiterate the main part of my post (one, I might add, that has been totally omitted from this entire comment thread because, as I pointed out, it’s easier to scream about gun-grabbing than it is to talk about sensible gun laws):
The Second Amendment: IT DOES NOT MEAN WHAT YOU HAVE BEEN TOLD TO THINK IT MEANS.
WELL REGULATED.
-DC
Oh, hey, at least she got shot with a family gun on her own private property instead of a “gun free” public zone:
msnbc.msn.com/id/33220258/ns/us_news-crime_and_courts/t/gun-toting-soccer-mom-found-shot-dead/#.UO4RwuRjrQB
Maybe if she had a few MORE guns…………………………………
And cars can be used for killing and well as many other things. And your wrong it depends what the owner want to do with the gun. Just because they have a gun doesn’t mean there a killer nor the gun is. Idiot. If they decide to hunt then there hunting for food. I’m assuming you eat and others feed you but you’ll never see that at the grocery store. I target and hunt and support my family and don’t need you nor others to try to stop my rights as I could figure out there is tons of anti gun Americans that do drugs mostly pot and tie die shirts peace. Peace
Oh, Herve, you just took the False Equivalency Test and BOMBED, miserably. I am going to say the same thing to you right now that I said to a moron on Facebook who tried to equate forks with guns because people die of heart disease:
If you are seriously posting THIS as your argument, you are a fucking moron.
Twenty eight people in Sandy Hook did not choose to walk into Adam Lanza’s house, take his crazy mother’s legally acquired guns, and shoot themselves to death.
Stupid false equivalencies are an insult to their memories, and an admission of your complete and utter stupidity.
Don’t be a total dumbass.
I know it’s hard, but seriously…….don’t go through the rest of your life being a total and complete dumbass.
Painfully ignorant is NO way to go through life, son.
That’s just sad.
I am a decorated Marine and Army veteran. We were trained to use these weapons in the defense of our country, not to destroy it. LaPierre and his ilk can burn in hell! Once I left the military, I vowed to never touch an assault weapon again. We know the death, destruction and damage they cause.
ThanK you for your service, Eternity.
It is interesting how often the people most trained with gunplay are the people least likely to romanticize their use. I have a lot of military friends and family, as well as law enforcement, and very few are of the mind that national gun ownership and the arming of teachers is the way we should go – it’s the weekend warrior types.
I see you have an image with an AR-15 that says it has a trigger capable of firing 100 rounds per minute. Such a gun, like ANY semi-auto will ONLY fire as fast as you can pull the trigger. That magazine pictured ONLY holds 30 rounds. It is not physically possible to fit 100 rounds in such a magazine. Large 100 round DRUM magazines are hard to come by, very expensive, and are prone to jamming. That’s why you don’t see many of them at all. Do not trample on other people’s rights by spreading lies and fear. Instead, you should seek to eliminate your own ignorance. Have good day, and take care.
Obviously you did not bother to note the published correction, or you would have made a comment that actually adds something to the conversation. instead of re-hashing points that have already been covered, extensively. You might eliminate some of your ignorance by reading a full post before commenting on it.
Toodles,
DC
The writer of this blog is a very misguided individual, indeed. She doesn’t understand what it means to live in a free state, she doesn’t understand what an “assault weapon” is, she doesn’t understand what the difference is between what you can lawfully purchase in a gun store and what is available to the military (two VERY different things), and she DOESN’T understand anything about the 2nd Amendment and why this country was founded. It was fought for, and won, by militia men and minute men who, hearing the call to arms, grabbed THEIR guns out of THEIR homes and went to battle against an encroaching tyrannical force. When that force commands the military, which it did in those times, and does in these times, the burden of winning liberty falls on the free man and whatever means of defense he/she has at his disposal (i.e. privately owned arms). I will not neuter my weapons, give them up, or do anything with them to compromise them in favor of appeasing freakishly scared people, like this writer, who will continually condone giving up a little more of her freedom for the ILLUSION of more security. When push comes to shove, YOU are responsible for YOUR own well-being, the well-being of those around you, and the preservation of liberty in the state in which you reside. If you cannot and/or will not stand up for those things, you might as well drive yourself to a concentration camp, and save the tyrant the trouble.
The writer of the preceding comment( Dave) does not have a full understanding of what the Founding Fathers demonstrably meant when they crafted the Second Amendment, and included the phrase
“well-regulated militia” within it. Perhaps Dave would like to pick up a history book and research the Militia Act of 1792, and read about what it did and what it required…..the second congress of the United states required every free, able-bodied white male citizen 18 -45 years old to join a local militia, and were required to show up for training twice a year. In addition, those owning firearms were required to register them in a public roll. The President had the power to call up the militias in a time of conflict, and those who disobeyed were subject to court martial.
What, exactly, does that sound like to you, Dave……that the 2nd amendment was interpreted as “every yahoo grab a gun and pillage the government”, or “every able citizen grab a gun and help defend against outside agitators or we’ll throw your ass in the brig”? You’ve been swallowing little too much Glenn Beck/David Barton revisionist history teabagger bullshit.
This writer has a 101 year-old grandmother who has taught her quite well the definition of freedom is, and what it means to live in a free state. If you are honestly of the opinion that the US is no longer a free state, perhaps you should move somewhere with a tad more freedom……….oh, wait a minute, all the people who want freedom are coming here.
Because here, when you disagree with the leader, you don’t get shot in the face or held under “house arrest” indefinitely (ooops, unless you look all brown and terrorist-y……thanks, Bush/Cheney Patriot Act!), and you don’t get herded into cattle cars bound for “deportation camps” where you get gassed and shoved into ovens. Seriously, you people have GOT to stop trying to co-opt the Holocaust imagery for your gun fellatio show, it’s crass, stupid, and just shows how weak your argument is.
Mandatory background checks and waiting periods do NOT equal THIS, and if you think they do you are an ignorant, sad little man who needs to grow up and learn some history.
DAVE pick up a history book and shut up till your done or make a line to get the fuck out of the country
You TOTALLY fail at reading, Herve.
I think it’s time for you to go back to your Tea Party sites where everyone speaks fluent Ignoramus.
Hurry, I can hear someone ranting about birth control, gays, and ethnically challenged people……..if you hurry you can fill tonight’s quota for WHARRRRRRGAAAARBLLLLLLLL!!!!!! angry white-man talk.
If you replace militia and arms with libraries and books it becomes clear-
“A well operated library being necessary for the literacy of a state, the right of the people to keep and read books shall not be infringed”
The state keeping or not keeping a library system operational in no way prevents or causes the right of the people to keep and read books.
The first part is simply a statement on why it is needed. The main point is The right of the people to keep and BEAR arms shall not be infringed.
Please look to the meaning of the text and not the literal translation.
Sorry for the delay in publishing your comment……..I have had a VERY busy past week and a half, and have woefully neglected my inbox.
The argument of most extreme gun rights fanatics IS the literal translation, which they fail to understand, and quite frankly, the ” ‘meaning’ versus ‘literal translation’ argument is disingenuous.
“Don’t interpret it by what they wrote, interpret it by what people who stand to make a huge profit off of your misinterpretation of what they wrote tell you to think it means.”
Your comment is great on it’s face, but your analogy fails in the end……..by that logic, I should expect to find large stores of kiddie porn offered up at my public library any day now. Screw that government, infringing on my right to pore over tomes of children engaged in all sorts of sexual activities, eh?
Yeah.
First of all kiddie porn is not free speech by any means.
But as far as my argument, you don’t have to take my word for it, simply read what the supreme court has to say in DC vs Heller.
(a) The Amendment’s prefatory clause announces a purpose, but does not limit or expand the scope of the second part, the operative clause. The operative clause’s text and history demonstrate that it connotes an individual right to keep and bear arms. Pp. 2–22.
(b) The prefatory clause comports with the Court’s interpretation of the operative clause. The “militia” comprised all males physically capable of acting in concert for the common defense. The Antifederalists feared that the Federal Government would disarm the people in order to disable this citizens’ militia, enabling a politicized standing army or a select militia to rule. The response was to deny Congress power to abridge the ancient right of individuals to keep and bear arms, so that the ideal of a citizens’ militia would be preserved. Pp. 22–28.
http://www.law.cornell.edu/supct/html/07-290.ZS.html
This is me not a cut and paste:
Many laws were written in this form they would give an example of justification and then the actual law.
Just to clarify the URL I posted is from law. cornell.edu, not some pro gun wacko site and it is a judgement from the US Supreme court which is the highest court in the land whose job it is to interpret the constitution.
I’d like to point out that…in order to meet the intent of the second amendment (as written by our forefathers) the term “well armed militia” must be relative to the military that our government commands. While the thought of civilians owning large caliber firearms and ammunition seems outrageous to most, in reality, it truly is necessary when the government controlled military has heavy armor. That military’s armor could stomp out the people of this nation easily if all they had to defend with were handguns and bolt action rifles.
Just food for thought.
I’m not comfortable with gun registration, but I do think mental health evaluations are necessary these days. I think that because it seems as though the people off this country choose to not take the time to be active in their children’s lives or their friend’s lives.
“it is a judgement from the US Supreme court which is the highest court in the land whose job it is to interpret the constitution.”
Mmmm-hmm. So, also by your logic, that mean that arguments about abortion, the healthcare law, affirmative action, civil rights in general, and anything else in the constitution should cease because he3y, a bunch of dudes came to a decision about that once upon a time and technology and society does not change or need review, and the Supreme Court is f course infallible.
Just because they make a ruling does not mean they interpreted every point correctly, or without influence from the very powerful gun lobby. All you have to do is listen to Scalia and others talk, and you know that their opinions are largely bought and paid for, and while Thomas does not talk much, his conflicts of interest and connections to lobbies are WELL documented.
END of argument.
My father passed away and I really have other shit on my mind than gun fondlers and their “right ” to own and publicly carry bazookas.
Sorry.
Where is the list of families that were killed by drunk drivers? I bet that list would wrap around the world a couple times. Maybe ban cars. I thought about all this one weekend and went upstairs to my gun safe, took out my AR-15 ( which stands for ArmaLite Rifle NOT Assault Rifle) I then took out two 50 round clips and 100 .223 full metal jacket ammo. I then walked onto my front deck and placed the rifle, clips (unloaded) and ammo on the chair looking at the street. I then left for the day. The mailman stop and dropped off my mail. My rifle didnt move an inch, it didnt load it-self or try to fire off a round at the mailman. Later on the neighbors kids came over to play with my kids. Still the rifle did not load it-self or try to fire off a round. Later that night there was a block party, but still my rifle never once load a single round and try to fire it off.
So to say that ” guns kill people ” is the most incorrect statement someone can make. From 2010 to 2011 there was 16,257 people killed from drunk drivers. Why are you not crying for them. My home is NOT A GUN FREE HOME. If you are wanting to break in and hurt my family I WILL SHOOT BACK. The ” Make My Day ” laws is there to protect my family.
So everyone that wants to try to make guns illegal, just think of one thing. . . . when have you known a criminal to obey the laws?
I find it interesting that you make the gun/ DUI comparison, Steve………
there are laws that limit the sale of alcohol.
There are laws that limit the licensing of drivers.
There are laws that restrict the ability of people who have behaved recklessly with their vehicles from operating them again
There are tests to be taken and insurance to e purchased before you are allowed to put a car on the road.
When victims of drunk drivers form organizations like MAAD and SAAD, alcohol manufactures partner WITH them and create programs to boost awareness instead of attacking them an saying the answer to drunken drivers is MORE drunken drivers.But,of course, if you actually read the post and the preceding comments, the ashattery of your badly-drawn parallel would have been painfully obvious to you and might have spared you the embarrassment of making such an incredibly disingenuous and bone-headed analogy in the first place.
And there is QUITE a difference between protecting your family and property and running around town in bars and other public establishments with a gun strapped on your hip. Legitimate defense and macho posturing penis enhancement are two VERY different things.
Just ask George Zimmerman, who would not be facing a trial for his life if he had followed police dispatch instructions instead of trying to play Dirty Harry.
Also quite interesting, and telling, is the fact that so many gun-fondlers are frothing to comment on a four month-old post because HOLYSHITOBAMAWANTSMUHGUNZ!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!, but a two day-old post about a missing child can’t be bothered with because hey, bitches can have more babies – I NEED MUH GUNZ.
Priorities.
We(don’t) have them.
http://www.missingkids.com/missingkids/servlet/PubCaseSearchServlet?act=viewPoster&caseNum=1214108&orgPrefix=NCMC&searchLang=en_US